History of Palestine and Israeli

[ellen pham]

I wrote Iqbal the following email, and she suggested I ask my questions to everyone in the forum. I will just copy the email here:

Hi Iqbal : )

Do you know of any good links that fully explain
the history of the conflict? For example, I still
don't understand why Palestinians and Jews didn't
just live together in one state in 1947. I hear
something about British colonialism, but honestly,
I don't even understand what that means! I know my
questions can sometimes sound very naive.
Honestly, Iqbal, most Americans learn nothing of
this history, nothing.

Love from your rather old student,
Ellen

Thank you for your help, moms and dads : )

[mary rizzo]

Dear Ellen,
It isn't an easy task to sort out 60 years of history (and some will place it farther back, to the end of the 1800s, when the project of a Jewish State was born in the logic of all the other nationalist movements of the time). But, that isn't saying it can't be done!

I don't think there are any "unbiased" sources, because there is always a moral to all of this: ie, is nationalism a good thing? If so, what kind of nationalism? Can it be ethnically based, or is it geographic? But, having a biased source isn't really a problem if the bias is based on what we have agreed upon as citizens in a world that seeks rule of law and not rule of the most powerful, and that means that one may indeed have a pro-palestinian bias, (which I do) but at the same time, it is not a prioristic. It is not because I am Palestinian (because I am not) but because I recognise the rights according to law and they have been violated in favour of Israel and against the Palestinians.

So, how to find out all the information? I would say the first thing is to never trust the mainstream media. They have a Pro-Israel bias. That is, they don't care that Israel violates International Law. What they would never tolerate for Iran or Argentina, in Israel is totally acceptable. So, this media operates on a bias that is based on miscarriage of justice and in order to uphold that, uses lies and fabrication. It wishes that the truth never gets out. It will say it is a religious conflict. This is a lie. It will say that the Palestinians rejected having their country being cut in two, which is true, but we have to think about whether that was right to do or not. In the context, it was absolutely right. Jews were only 22% of the population, why should they have 50% of the land? Then, there are many many other things that (once contextualised) allow us to see that Israel does not uphold any standards of human rights and in fact, it willfully does not have a constitution, legal and permanent borders, does not have secular laws (they are religiously based, and this discriminates against those who are not practicing Jews), they are in essence, not a democracy and not a legitmate State. But, this is something that will take a bit of reading on to learn more details.

I would suggest a brilliant book for you to read. Sandy Tolan's The Lemon Tree. It is probably (in a nutshell) the most comprehensive, easy to read and complete book on the history of Modern Israel. Told from the perspective of two families, a Jewish one and a Palestinian one, everything you need to begin your journey of awareness is in there. I think a lot of other sites can help with information. My own site is a compendium of articles, but you may want to look at Palestine Remembered, http://www.palestineremembered.com/Acre/Palestine-Remembered/Story7... which a brilliant man created. It has most of the questions and answers in one easy format.

Then, of course, to read the great Palestinian writers, Edward Said wrote an outstanding book "the Palestinian Question", the many fine journalists, Khaled Amayreh (who is in our group with us), our beloved and treasured Iqbal, Haitham Sabbah (also here) has an amazing blog, as does Akram, Nadia, Razan, Nancy(Umkahlil) (all people here in this group). I am glad you asked and I hope to have given you a small starter to answer a few of your questions!

[Iqbal Tamimi]

Our Ellene here is a perfect example of a very good American who knows very little about the Palestinian Plight. This is aperfect example that the people in the USA get the chosen present news delivered to people without any historical background. She might have heard about the massacres in Palestine, but the news would talk more about a rocket landed in Siderot without going back to talk about 60 year of torture to the Palestinian people.
The question to be asked here...should it be acceptable to build a state on relegious grounds? if so, then every cult or group of people who practice any form of spiritual belief should demand a country of their own.

[mary rizzo]

But, Iqbal, the problem with Israel is that it allows Jews to be defined as an ethnic and racial group (something that was rejected when it was Hitler doing it), not as a religious group, but it uses elements of the religion as a kind of body shield, so that people either say, "oh, it's something I don't understand" or "It's the business between the Muslims and the Jews, and I am neither". It is a way to make people stay out of investigating it. I know far more non-religious Jews than I do religious ones. I know far more Jews in Europe and the US than I do in Israel. What might this mean? That many do not recognise the call of having "their State", and it has other reasons to exist. Most of these reasons are not what we have been told!

It is going to take some time for people to get past the Mass Media lies, but that is an important first step, because it is obvious that either one accepts ethnic cleansing as right or wrong. If one rejects it, the entire history of Israel has to be reanalysed, since it is based on displacing the indigenous people and putting other people in their place. It requires the money and support of "the West", it is not self-sufficient. But the West should NOT support such a project. It's not in their interests, and it's not even legal!!

[ellen pham]

Thank you, Mary, for talking about bias (it is so important to be aware of when trying to learn anything about the world!) and for giving me a clear idea of where to start. I will find The Lemon tree today : ) It is so odd that what us Americans really do hold dear (separation of church and state; rights of the accused, the whole bill of rights, actually) are so disregarded in this situation. We hear that Israeli is a democracy, and that is why we support it (in a nutshell). What I want everyone to know in this forum is that I have NEVER heard an American talk with prejudice against the Palestinians... IF they care at all (and that is a problem, caring), they feel sympathy. There is anti-semiticism in America, not very much, but some, but the anti-semitics have nothing to do with being pro-Palestinian. They are racists against many people, including my own family (I am married to a man from Vietnam, our beautiful children are bi-racial.) One problem I see in educating Americans is our current fear of terrorism. This is played on shamelessly by our politicians, and like any people, there are many among us who do not want to think for themselves. 9/11 closed many peoples ears :(.

Peace be with you, dear, and I will be off to the bookstore soon.
Love,
Ellen

[mary rizzo]

Hi Ellen!
I'm so glad that my suggestions were of some help. I've been reading and writing on the issue since my "wake up call" in 1982 with the bloody massacre of Palestinian refugees in the Lebanese camps of Sabra and Shatila. Before that, I thought Israel was something great and wonderful. I just didn't know! The news didn't mention much about the massacre, but I happened to have a classmate who was Jordanian and who told me about it. I remember throwing up when I saw the pictures, and they are nothing compared to what modern warfare has invented by way of destroying humans. It was the bodies of old women, young girls, toppled over one another that just hurt so much. This was when I started to learn the history and one brick fell out of the wall after the other. It was a rapid and crushing blow for me. In the space of two weeks, I went from a Pro-Israel person to an Anti-Israel person. In polite company, I say Pro-Palestinian, because I am for their rights, but realising just what Israel is, one cannot stand by it, it goes hand in hand with supporting Palestinians.

Then, you will hear that people say this means destruction of Jews, which is untrue. It is propaganda for people to not even look at Israel, because if they do, they will not only throw up, but they will get angry and protest and act and make politicians be responsible for the horror they support.

But, also, what you say about the American people is also true. I lived half of my life in the US, and I know that the Americans really do want and value justice. They simply are totally distracted and detached from doing anything about it though! And you get someone like Bush who wants people to be afraid of terrorists, and it just messes up clear thinking. There is FAR more to fear from the US govt than from any Terrorist they dream up to scare people into giving more and more control to the guys in power.

I know you will love the book! I wrote a review of it on my blog, so once you start, you might like to take a look at that. http://peacepalestine.blogspot.com/2006/09/lemon-tree-by-sandy-tola...

I've been writing to the author (and to his agent... I am trying to buy the Italian rights for this book, but still haven't got the funding necessary!) and he really has written such a valuable book that I believe will remain as one of the core texts when the debate actually is allowed to be held!

Sending a lot of love to you and all your loved ones!
mary

[Feda]

Ellen, Hi my name is Feda and I subscribe to Washington Report on Middle East Affairs. I found this on their website that might help you make sense of it all. Its is written by --Jews for Justice in the Middle East explaining history and true facts to other Jewish people. I will upload the article "The Origin of the Palestine-Israel Conflict". If for some reason I do not do this right. Please check out the Washington Report on Middle East Affairs website at www.wrmea.com. Let me know what you think. Peace Always, Feda.

[Iqbal Tamimi]

Dear Feda,
the minuet I started reading the introduction I found lots of wrong information and we should stop at to discuss, the report says

' The standard Zionist position is that they showed up in Palestine in the late 19th century to reclaim their ancestral homeland. Jews bought land and started building up the Jewish community there. They were met with increasingly violent opposition from the Palestinian Arabs, presumably stemming from the Arabs' inherent anti-Semitism. The Zionists were then forced to defend themselves and, in one form or another, this same situation continues up to today'.

Even this little paragraph is not telling the truth:

Reclaim their ancestral land... it has not been their ancestral land, when the Jews came to Palestine long ago with Moses peace be upon him, they fought people who were there, even then there were people. Palestine was never empty of people. They came at some point of history also to live in Palestine. They can't claim it was their ancestors land.
And even if it was the ancestor's land of some Jews, they are certainly not the same Jews who came to claim it. The ones claiming our land now had nothing to do with Moses or the people who were with him. Some are from Russia or Poland, or India....they embraced Judaism late in history, they are not connected in any way to Palestine or to Moses, or the people who were with Moses in any way. If one should claim a land because he was able at some time of history to occupy then Arabs are allowed to reclaim Spain since they ruled Andalusia.... this is total madness. religion was never a good reason to start a state because this state will be built on racism and excluding people of other beliefs and faiths from having equal rights

[Iqbal Tamimi]

There is a book for the researcher Naila Alwaari titled « The Role of foreign consulates in Jewish immigration and settlement in Palestine 1840 - 1914». This book documents how England amongst other countries through their consulates started implanting the Jewish state in Palestine since 1876. Unfortunately her book is not translated yet to English. She has obtained documents published and un published, secret archives and non secret ones for different embassies and consulates, foreign ministries, and research centres. Even in the Zionist archive, and Istanbul Astana the capital of the Ottoman Empire, and many embassies helped Jews to emigrate to Palestine, and helped them to Palestinian lands like British, French, Russian, German, and Austrian.
The researcher obtained the municipality’s records of Palestinian cities and courts records which document the ownerships in Jerusalem, Akko, Nablus, Java and other Palestinian cities. There you can see all the legal and illegal ways used to take away Palestinian properties taken away from the state and from individuals and families.
All the documents emphasize one important fact, the foreign embassies and consulates in Palestine shared the guilt of helping the Zionists to Palestinian land from 1876-1908.
You can read the text of a letter written by the British Foreign Minister to the British Consul in Jerusalem 1858 which stated:
« The British Government is trying hard to devote the British presence in Jerusalem, and in other cities to protect its vital interests, and the interests of its Jewish Nationals, and it is your duty to protect Jews arriving in Palestine claiming they came for sacred journeys, and to make sure they are not turned away. This is a military duty you are going to be questioned for »!

[Feda]

Salaams Iqbal, The next paragraph states, "The problem with this explanation is that it is simply not true, as the documentary evidence in this booklet will show. What really happened was that the Zionist movement, from the beginning, looked forward to a practically complete dispossession of the indigenous Arab population so that Israel could be a wholly Jewish state, or as much as was possible. Land bought by the Jewish National Fund was held in the name of the Jewish people and could never be sold or even leased back to Arabs (a situation which continues to the present)."
If I am wrong about this article please delete it off the website. Salaams Always, Feda

[Iqbal Tamimi]

Feda, you have done the right thing, we have questions... then we put all the knowledge we know from different resources, then compare the facts and come up with our own understanding of what has happened. Here we have the best ways of finding facts. Some references did not cover all the facts, others did not have enough information, others were a litle bit biassed... keep the good work honey. Thank you for sharing with us what you have been reading.... lots of love.

[ellen pham]

Dear Iqbal, Mary & Feda,

I found The Lemon Tree yesterday and began reading... I have already learned a little bit, perhaps... Iqbal, did you put the "e" at the end of Ellen, Ellene, to show a little sweetness to me and acceptance, because to add an "e" is a very old and traditional way in spoken Arabic? Now I admit I am extrapolating : ), in The Lemon Tree the author talks about this spelling and pronunciation in regards to town names! So I might be making an incorrect inference, but I still liked it : )).

I also bought Said's From Olso to Iraq. Mary, you had suggested him as an historian, and the store did not have the book you mentioned, The Palestine Question. I hope this will be a good book that will help me better understand the current situation, and how what is happening in Israel is related to our invasion/occupation of Iraq. Again, dear sisters, it might be hard to believe, but your average American has no idea why we are in Iraq!! Any of the explanations we are given don't make sense, so we just end up confused.... most of us assume it has to do with the oil reserves.

Anyway, I am planning on getting a good chunk of the reading done this weekend, and will keep posting as questions and ideas come up. I want to thank each of you for your acceptance and your help, and never making me feel like I wasn't intelligent enough to think through this for myself.

xox Ellen (this is how I end my letters to my family and friends, xox means hugs and kisses)

[Iqbal Tamimi]

Ellaaaa... Ellen sweetheart, we can't thank you enough for caring. Not many people go through the effort to try to understand why others are in pain, believe me when I tell you even though I have never met in my life I already feel like you are under my skin, like my blood sisters. Caring about others is a blessing not many have. Regarding the way we add or manipulate the letters of a name is a way of showing more love and departing from formalities. Like calling our dear Mary Mimi, or in Arabic I would call her Marmar. Regardless of what we call each other all of you are extra special family members.